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Discussion Starter #1
Hello all. I have a 2011 Pro 4x that is our family adventure vehicle. It is stock and I would like to keep it as stock as possible. Last year we did a Moab trip and did Fins n Things, Long’s Canyon and a few other mild trails. Had no issue on Fins. We will be going back in the summer of 2020 and would like to do Imogene pass in CO and then head back to Moab to try Hells Revenge (willing to take bypasses). Do you guys think the stock pro 4x skid plates are adequate for hells revenge? I do plan to add rocker sliders but am not sure about factory skids. If they are not adequate which factory plates should be replaced with aftermarket? I am careful and conservative while driving but want to make sure I get back home without damaging radiator, front diff and pans. Thanks for your advice!
 

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You'd be absolutely fine doing any trial in Ouray EXCEPT Mineral Creek and Poughkeepsie. The former one is now a full on armor checker and the later always has been

Hell's.... you can likely get through it with stock skids and no rock Sliders, depending on your driving skills, knowledge of the trail, and spotter..... however.... the exit to the trail (which has no bypass) has gotten chewed badly, and not a stock rig friendly moment.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Thanks for advice. So it seems like good to go on Imogene and Hells but the ending will require caution and a good spotter but is doable in stock rig?
 

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My vote is get sliders for sure, but you can probably relax with your stock skids. In my Moab experience, seems like sliding on rockers (sliders) is more necessary than bumping the rest of undercarriage. Most Moab trails are lots of smooth rock with very few surprises as opposed to coastal trails where you will have a sharp rock hidden in mud that will jump into your oil pan.
 

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Imo, this is a classic "Could You" vs "Should You" discussion.

Can you enjoy an intermediate Moab trail with but a flimsy sheet metal skid to protect the vitals of your engine/drivetrain? As has been said, with the proper level of skill and an experienced spotter the answer is "Yes."

However, the question which is left unanswered is " Should you."

If everything don't follow a best case scenario, would you be ok being stranded until help arrives?

I'm a bit more conservative and would invest in some armor .
 

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Thanks for advice. So it seems like good to go on Imogene and Hells but the ending will require caution and a good spotter but is doable in stock rig?
Imogene, Corkscrew, California, Engineer, Hurricane, Red Mountain, Ophir, Stony Pass... YES (although caution should be observed). Mineral Creek and Poughkeepsie, absolutely not.

That's not what I said about Hell's.... You can do most of Hell's with good skills, a good spotter, and easy lines in a stock rig, but I wouldn't because the exit is not for the faint of heart. It's not an easy spot, there is no bypass, and you could end up in real trouble.

Not to diminish what others may have said, but I have driven about 60 of the 80 ish trails in Moab, most of them many, many times, I have led trails the last three years at GONE and on many other trips. It is my personal opinion that unless it's green in the Funtreks book, you should have sliders and skids (real ones), particularly if you aren't lifted with 33's. Trails there change, drastically from year to year (i.e. Long Canyon has had moments of being nearly impassable with 35's and Locked). If one makes a mistake (which happens on daily basis down there) the cost to get your rig out could be upwards of 2 to 5 thousand dollars, and then you get fix it.

I'm not trying to put the fear of God into you, but rather an abundance of caution. Rigs break, things go south, a tire slips off a rock, a large rock tips up, who knows. Things I've seen on the trail.... Broken CV's, busted drive shafts, blown differentials, air bags deploy, roll overs, blown shocks, broken LCA's, Flat tires, blown power steering hoses, blown steering rack, holes punched in oil pans. Do you have tools to repair your rig on the trail? Do you have spare parts?

Remember, you not only have to drive it home, you have to drive it off the trail. Don't go alone, and carry all the rescue gear you need to rescue yourself, because depending on the trail, and the time of year, you may not see anyone for many hours, or even days.

Take it for what it's worth, make your own judgement call.

And PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE, DO NOT STEP, WALK, or DRIVE on the Cryptobiotic soil. Stay the trail, Tread lightly, it's a very fragile environment.

Most Moab trails are lots of smooth rock with very few surprises
I'm sorry to be so blunt, but that statement is just plain foolish, and ignorant.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Thanks everyone for you input. I am now planning on skids and sliders just to be safe. I have tools and will carry extra CVs. I plan to do hell’s on the weekend during the summer so there should be traffic in case of anything major. I was thinking skids for everything except gas tank. I also plan to install a front lokka to help strengthen the front diff as well.
 

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I'm sorry to be so blunt, but that statement is just plain foolish, and ignorant.
The wording of my statement was probably a little too broad. There are plenty of surprises in Moab (drop offs, steepness, sudden weather changes, etc.)

What I was speaking about was in terms of pointy, undercarriage-damaging rocks. It is usually clear and dry. Slickrock is worn smooth and is not very random. Obstacles (e.g. big slickrock edge climbs, flexy V's like hell's gate) are usually fairly stable and don't shift while you drive on them. Compare that to trails like in my home state of WA or on the East coast where it is much wetter. There are lots of smaller, shifting rocks with mud that will have you slide off and land your engine square on a point. Or there might be a rock hidden in mud that gets hung up on your shock mount. Something like this:

123993


If I was skidless and mostly stock and had the option of doing a Red trail in moab vs. a blue trail with some number of rocks in WA, I would be more concerned about the blue trail in terms of overall damage.
 

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Thanks everyone for you input. I am now planning on skids and sliders just to be safe. I have tools and will carry extra CVs. I plan to do hell’s on the weekend during the summer so there should be traffic in case of anything major. I was thinking skids for everything except gas tank. I also plan to install a front lokka to help strengthen the front diff as well.
Forget the Lokka, it is not needed and will only cause you issues on the slickrock, spend that money on a gas tank skid. (also one of the reasons I've seen so many busted CV's)


If I was skidless and mostly stock and had the option of doing a Red trail in moab vs. a blue trail with some number of rocks in WA
And the prudent thing to do would be to pass on both of them.

I stand by my first response to you.
 

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IM1RU so will the front diff hold up ok for my plans(mild CO passes and bucket list hells revenge)? Is an unlocked 205 any better with respect to spider gear breakage? Thanks
 

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IM1RU so will the front diff hold up ok for my plans(mild CO passes and bucket list hells revenge)? Is an unlocked 205 any better with respect to spider gear breakage? Thanks
That is entirely dependent on your driving (but in my opinion the open R180 is just fine). More importantly, Wheel spin in Moab is a killer, and will break nearly everything (don't spin). The throttle pedal is rarely your friend in Moab. Moab simply has an unreasonable amount of grip on the slickrock, and if you spin a wheel in the air and come down on it spinning, chances are high you will break something. A locker will prevent spider gear breaks (because they are no longer there), but will also transfer the load to the CV's which then become the weak point. A CV break is clearly an easier trail fix than a Diff break. An open 205 is stronger, yes (but hardly worth the expense for that reason only)

If you need a little help getting over something apply the brake a little bit (2 foot driving). It causes the ABS system to "lock" the front end and you essentially have a "poor mans locker" Do not drive all day long with the rear locker on. Turn it on and off as you need it, if you need it.

Point of reference. I am driving an open R180 front diff. It is re-geared to 4.10's, but it is open. I am also running 33's. I have never had any issues at all. I wheel with maXTERRA a lot, he is running a locked M205 with 4.56's and 35's, we do the same stuff all day long.

I strongly recommend you remove both sway bars before wheeling in Moab. Drive with them out here, remove them when you get here, and put them back on when you leave. (if you still have them) The additional flex in the suspension will help you greatly.

Also, on Hell's, do not attempt Hell's Gate, The Escalator, or Tip Over Challenge. All three are located at the far end of the trail by the overlook. I also suggest you get the Funtreks book and GPS tracks card. If you are doing the trail alone (1 rig) be very cautious and scout things you can't see, there are lots of hidden places that can cause a roll over (you can't see them from the drivers seat)
Keep your tires on the black marks, and if there is a white paint mark on the slickrock, keep the paint mark in the middle of your truck as you drive, and you'll be fine.
 
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